Novice Seeking Advice on Color Management

Forums: 
Hi all- I'm just getting back into photography and am looking for some advice in getting my workflow/setup in order. I currently use a Nikon D7000. Right now I'm working on a Dell Inspiron 1750 laptop, using Photoshop CS5 and Lightroom 4. I have an Epson R3000 printer which, sadly, I have not experimented much with. Computer Is it workable to continue using my laptop? I have an iMac but don't have Photoshop or Lightroom for it and would probably have to make a definitive choice of PC vs Mac, which makes me nervous. Can I get good results sticking with my laptop for now? Should I consider going Mac in the future or stick with a PC? I realize that this may be entirely based on preference but I'm wondering if there are technical advantages to either that I'm not aware of. Scanner I have a lot of 35mm negs/transparencies as well as 120 negs which I would like to digitize so I'm thinking about getting a scanner to do it myself, rather than take each one to a lab to have scanned. Any thoughts on the complexities/hassle of learning how to use a scanner? Many years ago I could operate a drum scanner at work but I'm more than a little rusty. The models I'm looking at are either the Epson Perfection v700 or v750. I know that the SilverFast Ai software is a bit confusing to use, but I was assured by the manuf that it would work on Vista 64 bit. Color Calibration Next, I need to implement a color management system. I'm interested in the ColorMunki Photo. Will I be able to calibrate my laptop monitor satisfactorily or should I consider an external monitor better suited for photography? Why can't I find it on sale right now?! General Can someone point me in the direction of some good resources for learning how to work the ColorMunki, how to learn how to use the Epson scanner and how to improve my skills? I'm so frustrated that I've fallen behind over the years! I have a deep photography background but I got sidetracked as a web developer and then as a mom and am anxious to get my groove back! What I really need is a mentor but don't know how to find one so I'm asking you all for help! Many, many thanks in advance for your guidance! Anne

Anne G. wrote: Hi all- I'm just getting back into photography and am looking for some advice in getting my workflow/setup in order. I currently use a Nikon D7000. Right now I'm working on a Dell Inspiron 1750 laptop, using Photoshop CS5 and Lightroom 4. I have an Epson R3000 printer which, sadly, I have not experimented much with. Computer Is it workable to continue using my laptop? I have an iMac but don't have Photoshop or Lightroom for it and would probably have to make a definitive choice of PC vs Mac, which makes me nervous. Can I get good results sticking with my laptop for now? Should I consider going Mac in the future or stick with a PC? I realize that this may be entirely based on preference but I'm wondering if there are technical advantages to either that I'm not aware of. Scanner I have a lot of 35mm negs/transparencies as well as 120 negs which I would like to digitize so I'm thinking about getting a scanner to do it myself, rather than take each one to a lab to have scanned. Any thoughts on the complexities/hassle of learning how to use a scanner? Many years ago I could operate a drum scanner at work but I'm more than a little rusty. The models I'm looking at are either the Epson Perfection v700 or v750. I know that the SilverFast Ai software is a bit confusing to use, but I was assured by the manuf that it would work on Vista 64 bit. Color Calibration Next, I need to implement a color management system. I'm interested in the ColorMunki Photo. Will I be able to calibrate my laptop monitor satisfactorily or should I consider an external monitor better suited for photography? Why can't I find it on sale right now?! General Can someone point me in the direction of some good resources for learning how to work the ColorMunki, how to learn how to use the Epson scanner and how to improve my skills? I'm so frustrated that I've fallen behind over the years! I have a deep photography background but I got sidetracked as a web developer and then as a mom and am anxious to get my groove back! What I really need is a mentor but don't know how to find one so I'm asking you all for help! Many, many thanks in advance for your guidance! Anne
In my three part video I take you through all the steps in calibrating and creating printer profiles with the COLOR MUNKI 1st part is a lecture than I get inot the process. 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScojQ7dWAFU 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqda4F9YlLU 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmkI5EcPbI

jtoolman wrote:
Anne G. wrote: Hi all- I'm just getting back into photography and am looking for some advice in getting my workflow/setup in order. I currently use a Nikon D7000. Right now I'm working on a Dell Inspiron 1750 laptop, using Photoshop CS5 and Lightroom 4. I have an Epson R3000 printer which, sadly, I have not experimented much with. Computer Is it workable to continue using my laptop? I have an iMac but don't have Photoshop or Lightroom for it and would probably have to make a definitive choice of PC vs Mac, which makes me nervous. Can I get good results sticking with my laptop for now? Should I consider going Mac in the future or stick with a PC? I realize that this may be entirely based on preference but I'm wondering if there are technical advantages to either that I'm not aware of. Scanner I have a lot of 35mm negs/transparencies as well as 120 negs which I would like to digitize so I'm thinking about getting a scanner to do it myself, rather than take each one to a lab to have scanned. Any thoughts on the complexities/hassle of learning how to use a scanner? Many years ago I could operate a drum scanner at work but I'm more than a little rusty. The models I'm looking at are either the Epson Perfection v700 or v750. I know that the SilverFast Ai software is a bit confusing to use, but I was assured by the manuf that it would work on Vista 64 bit. Color Calibration Next, I need to implement a color management system. I'm interested in the ColorMunki Photo. Will I be able to calibrate my laptop monitor satisfactorily or should I consider an external monitor better suited for photography? Why can't I find it on sale right now?! General Can someone point me in the direction of some good resources for learning how to work the ColorMunki, how to learn how to use the Epson scanner and how to improve my skills? I'm so frustrated that I've fallen behind over the years! I have a deep photography background but I got sidetracked as a web developer and then as a mom and am anxious to get my groove back! What I really need is a mentor but don't know how to find one so I'm asking you all for help! Many, many thanks in advance for your guidance! Anne
In my three part video I take you through all the steps in calibrating and creating printer profiles with the COLOR MUNKI 1st part is a lecture than I get inot the process. 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScojQ7dWAFU 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqda4F9YlLU 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmkI5EcPbI
Hi jtoolman. Your videos were important in my decision to buy CM Photo. The system is working very well for me. Thanks for taking the time to make these helpful lessons. Sal

jtoolman wrote In my three part video I take you through all the steps in calibrating and creating printer profiles with the COLOR MUNKI 1st part is a lecture than I get inot the process. 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScojQ7dWAFU 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqda4F9YlLU 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmkI5EcPbI
Thank you so much for the youtube videos! They were very instructive and have demystified the whole process for me. Looks like the ColorMunki will be on my Christmas list this year!

Anne G. wrote: Hi all- I'm just getting back into photography and am looking for some advice in getting my workflow/setup in order. I currently use a Nikon D7000. Right now I'm working on a Dell Inspiron 1750 laptop, using Photoshop CS5 and Lightroom 4. I have an Epson R3000 printer which, sadly, I have not experimented much with. Computer Is it workable to continue using my laptop? I have an iMac but don't have Photoshop or Lightroom for it and would probably have to make a definitive choice of PC vs Mac,
Adobe allows you to install Photoshop and LR on two computers, providing you do not use them at the same time.
which makes me nervous. Can I get good results sticking with my laptop for now? Should I consider going Mac in the future or stick with a PC? I realize that this may be entirely based on preference but I'm wondering if there are technical advantages to either that I'm not aware of.
Laptop monitors are particularly difficult to calibrate. If you have the option, then an external monitor is almost always better. Either a pc or mac, it doesn't matter as much as having a good monitor to go with it. Brian A

Adobe allows you to install Photoshop and LR on two computers, providing you do not use them at the same time.
In a little more detail: each Photoshop license (as with most software) is either for Windows, or for MacOS. You can install up to twice on whichever platform you have bought for. If you need to switch, there's a fee AFAIK to get a different license number from Adobe and you need to cease using the software on the prior OS. However, I am pretty sure you can switch platform as part of a paid version upgrade. On the other hand, each Lightroom license is installable up to twice on whichever you like: both Windows, both MacOS, or one of each. It's no problem at all to switch later. Another option is to combine LR with either PS Elements or else some older version of PS - which may prove sufficient. Many of the added automation, up-to-date Raw support and Bridge workflow features that you get by having a current copy of full Photoshop, are not so relevant in a setup where LR already has much of this covered. Also the ongoing costs of keeping up-to-date are then much lower.
Laptop monitors are particularly difficult to calibrate. If you have the option, then an external monitor is almost always better.
Definitely the case for cheaper laptops - very frustrating (viewing-angle problems) and imprecise for both hue and tone, even if you do clamp your head in one place. I read somewhere of an interesting setup using an iPad as a second monitor - which is at least of good quality. However a good desktop monitor, with a reasonably high vertical resolution in particular, makes especially the Lightroom interface much nicer and more comfortable. Some widescreen aspect laptops are much less than 1000px high, so can show only a narrow window onto the LR or PS adjustment panels. You spend your whole time scrolling, collapsing and expanding things in order to get to the subpanel you need.

richardplondon wrote:
Adobe allows you to install Photoshop and LR on two computers, providing you do not use them at the same time.
In a little more detail: each Photoshop license (as with most software) is either for Windows, or for MacOS. You can install up to twice on whichever platform you have bought for. If you need to switch, there's a fee AFAIK to get a different license number from Adobe and you need to cease using the software on the prior OS. However, I am pretty sure you can switch platform as part of a paid version upgrade. On the other hand, each Lightroom license is installable up to twice on whichever you like: both Windows, both MacOS, or one of each. It's no problem at all to switch later. Another option is to combine LR with either PS Elements or else some older version of PS - which may prove sufficient. Many of the added automation, up-to-date Raw support and Bridge workflow features that you get by having a current copy of full Photoshop, are not so relevant in a setup where LR already has much of this covered. Also the ongoing costs of keeping up-to-date are then much lower.
Laptop monitors are particularly difficult to calibrate. If you have the option, then an external monitor is almost always better.
Definitely the case for cheaper laptops - very frustrating (viewing-angle problems) and imprecise for both hue and tone, even if you do clamp your head in one place. I read somewhere of an interesting setup using an iPad as a second monitor - which is at least of good quality. However a good desktop monitor, with a reasonably high vertical resolution in particular, makes especially the Lightroom interface much nicer and more comfortable. Some widescreen aspect laptops are much less than 1000px high, so can show only a narrow window onto the LR or PS adjustment panels. You spend your whole time scrolling, collapsing and expanding things in order to get to the subpanel you need.
I was aware that Photoshop will make you choose. I had to spend some time on the phone with them before they would actually say that they will let you switch platforms with an upgrade rather than purchasing a new copy. I bought my first copy of Photoshop as version 1.0 so I'd hate to calculate how much I've spent on it over the years! Thanks so much for letting me know that Lightoom can be installed on two computers! Great to know. Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get. Thanks so much!!

Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
For that sort of price range, I would look at a 22 inch NEC. Brian A

Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
For that sort of price range, I would look at a 22 inch NEC. Brian A
I use a 27" NEC, but a smaller size would fit your budget better. Looks like we have followed a similiar path. I too started with PS1 (only for Mac in those early years) . . . and have had every version since. Now us PS CS6 on a very fast PC. As age creeps up on me, I find the 27" monitor very age friendly!

Steve Bingham wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
For that sort of price range, I would look at a 22 inch NEC. Brian A
I use a 27" NEC, but a smaller size would fit your budget better. Looks like we have followed a similiar path. I too started with PS1 (only for Mac in those early years) . . . and have had every version since. Now us PS CS6 on a very fast PC. As age creeps up on me, I find the 27" monitor very age friendly!
I will definitely look at the NECs. Since I've been looking at a 17" laptop screen for so long now, any larger size will seem massive! I remember those early days so well! My first ever computer was an Apple IIci. It cost a small fortune. Back then, I was learning Desktop Publishing and was using Photoshop and a long-gone competing program called Colorstudio. I worked for printing companies, ad agencies, service bureaus for many years and then transitioned to the web in the mid 1990s. That's when I had to switch to a PC. I think I read somewhere that I will need to upgrade to CS6 before the end of the year if I plan to upgrade to CS7 in the future at the upgrade price. Anyone know for sure?

Anne G. wrote: I think I read somewhere that I will need to upgrade to CS6 before the end of the year if I plan to upgrade to CS7 in the future at the upgrade price. Anyone know for sure?
http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/faq.html#upgrade-eligibility Brian A

Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
For that sort of price range, I would look at a 22 inch NEC. Brian A
I use a 27" NEC, but a smaller size would fit your budget better. Looks like we have followed a similiar path. I too started with PS1 (only for Mac in those early years) . . . and have had every version since. Now us PS CS6 on a very fast PC. As age creeps up on me, I find the 27" monitor very age friendly!
I will definitely look at the NECs. Since I've been looking at a 17" laptop screen for so long now, any larger size will seem massive! I remember those early days so well! My first ever computer was an Apple IIci. It cost a small fortune. Back then, I was learning Desktop Publishing and was using Photoshop and a long-gone competing program called Colorstudio. I worked for printing companies, ad agencies, service bureaus for many years and then transitioned to the web in the mid 1990s. That's when I had to switch to a PC. I think I read somewhere that I will need to upgrade to CS6 before the end of the year if I plan to upgrade to CS7 in the future at the upgrade price. Anyone know for sure?
You can upgrade from PS CS5 to PS CS6 any time up to the next release, PS CS7. The new policy is you can no longer skip a version after Jan 1, 2013. Example: After Jan 1, 2013 you may no longer go from PS CS4 (or earlier) to PS CS6 at the upgrade price.

Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
The ASUS PA246Q is a great monitor for under $500. I use it with my desktop system and have profiled it with i1 Profiler but it was so good out of the box that the profiling step was not really necessary. http://www.amazon.com/PA246Q-24-Inch-Professional-Super-IPS-Full-HD/dp/B005NM8PB6 It is 1920x1200 pixels. That might be more than your laptop can support. You should find out the maximum resolution your laptop can support before buying any external monitor. Tom

Tom-C wrote:
Anne G. wrote: Looks like the consensus is that I definitely need a new monitor! Can anyone recommend one under $500? I found a good post regarding monitor selection, http://forums.dpzen.com/forums/post/50354863, but I got hung up comparing the different options. The poster seemed to rule out Dells because they don't have programmable internal hardware. They are cheaper so I'd love some thoughts on which brand/model I should get.
The ASUS PA246Q is a great monitor for under $500. I use it with my desktop system and have profiled it with i1 Profiler but it was so good out of the box that the profiling step was not really necessary. http://www.amazon.com/PA246Q-24-Inch-Professional-Super-IPS-Full-HD/dp/B005NM8PB6 It is 1920x1200 pixels. That might be more than your laptop can support. You should find out the maximum resolution your laptop can support before buying any external monitor. Tom
Oh that's a very good point! I'd better check on that or else my Christmas list is going to get out of control with a ColorMunki, new monitor AND new computer. I know I've been good this year but I think Santa would draw the line at a new computer!

One point to cosider in the choice between Mac and PC. I have both, bought Mac because I heard it was SO much better for photography. After a year using a MacBook Pro I cant wait to get my PS's up and running again BECAUSE: Apple do all the software updates I need by replacing the ENTIRE original, thus a 750mb program requires 750mb to update. If like me you are not in a big City where there are a lot of providers offering broadband at really good prices for unlimited usage you are in real trouble or up for rediculous sums to keep the thing running One Apple upgrade chews through almost a third of a months broadband, at A$40 per 1.5 gig that is a killer. Windows patches are tiny. Next Apple CONTROL your computer 24/7 and are constantly interfering /snooping. I have tried switching off their remote access, they get around it. I have wiped all cookies, they get around it..... Next they are now dumbing down just about everything, they call it making the product more user friendly for the mass consumer market. For me as a photographer the losses will eventually impact how I process with Lightroom and Photoshop I believe. Finally I am constantly finding that there are just SO many things that are no longer supported because the have a commercial time horizon applied..........Thank goodness I shied away from buying a pro tower with the capacity of my PC.......then I would have had a $7,000 boat anchor!! and been in debt for broadband just to keep the thing running!!!!! Thus for me this unit is an overpriced boat anchor that wont even hold a boat in place.....Will be relgated to being used on field trips to download Cards to Lightroom and no more. When it dies it will be taken to the seaside to help build a reef...........

AusPic wrote: One point to cosider in the choice between Mac and PC. I have both, bought Mac because I heard it was SO much better for photography. After a year using a MacBook Pro I cant wait to get my PS's up and running again BECAUSE: Apple do all the software updates I need by replacing the ENTIRE original, thus a 750mb program requires 750mb to update. If like me you are not in a big City where there are a lot of providers offering broadband at really good prices for unlimited usage you are in real trouble or up for rediculous sums to keep the thing running One Apple upgrade chews through almost a third of a months broadband, at A$40 per 1.5 gig that is a killer. Windows patches are tiny. Next Apple CONTROL your computer 24/7 and are constantly interfering /snooping. I have tried switching off their remote access, they get around it. I have wiped all cookies, they get around it..... Next they are now dumbing down just about everything, they call it making the product more user friendly for the mass consumer market. For me as a photographer the losses will eventually impact how I process with Lightroom and Photoshop I believe. Finally I am constantly finding that there are just SO many things that are no longer supported because the have a commercial time horizon applied..........Thank goodness I shied away from buying a pro tower with the capacity of my PC.......then I would have had a $7,000 boat anchor!! and been in debt for broadband just to keep the thing running!!!!! Thus for me this unit is an overpriced boat anchor that wont even hold a boat in place.....Will be relgated to being used on field trips to download Cards to Lightroom and no more. When it dies it will be taken to the seaside to help build a reef...........
I have to say that I did balk at the pricing! I got an iMac for my kids this year and I have an iPad and iPhone, so that may be the extent of my foray back into the Mac world. PC's are definitely a better value. Thanks so much for your thoughts!

Anne G. wrote: Hi all- I'm just getting back into photography and am looking for some advice in getting my workflow/setup in order. I currently use a Nikon D7000. Right now I'm working on a Dell Inspiron 1750 laptop, using Photoshop CS5 and Lightroom 4. I have an Epson R3000 printer which, sadly, I have not experimented much with. Computer Is it workable to continue using my laptop? I have an iMac but don't have Photoshop or Lightroom for it and would probably have to make a definitive choice of PC vs Mac, which makes me nervous. Can I get good results sticking with my laptop for now? Should I consider going Mac in the future or stick with a PC? I realize that this may be entirely based on preference but I'm wondering if there are technical advantages to either that I'm not aware of.
PC will be much cheaper in the long run. However, serious PS CS5 editing should not be done on a laptop - even one that has been calibrated. Luminance, as well as color and saturation can change due to viewing angle - on even the top of the line laptops..
Scanner I have a lot of 35mm negs/transparencies as well as 120 negs which I would like to digitize so I'm thinking about getting a scanner to do it myself, rather than take each one to a lab to have scanned. Any thoughts on the complexities/hassle of learning how to use a scanner? Many years ago I could operate a drum scanner at work but I'm more than a little rusty. The models I'm looking at are either the Epson Perfection v700 or v750. I know that the SilverFast Ai software is a bit confusing to use, but I was assured by the manuf that it would work on Vista 64 bit.
These will never equal a drum scan, but they will be MANY times cheaper!!!!!
Color Calibration Next, I need to implement a color management system. I'm interested in the ColorMunki Photo. Will I be able to calibrate my laptop monitor satisfactorily or should I consider an external monitor better suited for photography? Why can't I find it on sale right now?!
Calibrating a laptop is questionable at nest. Better to use an extrenal monitor.
General Can someone point me in the direction of some good resources for learning how to work the ColorMunki, how to learn how to use the Epson scanner and how to improve my skills? I'm so frustrated that I've fallen behind over the years! I have a deep photography background but I got sidetracked as a web developer and then as a mom and am anxious to get my groove back!
ColorMunki comes with easy to follow directions, as does the i1 (Eye 1) which I prefer.
What I really need is a mentor but don't know how to find one so I'm asking you all for help!
You will do just fine. Jump in, the waters fine.
Many, many thanks in advance for your guidance! Anne

In repsonse to OP there has been considerable advice against using a laptop for photo editing. If I understand correctly, most or all of the negative opinion regarding using a laptop relates to the monitor stability and calibration response. All that seems perfectly sensible. But if that is so, and there is nothing wrong with the computing power and interface of an appropriately configured laptop (requisite speed, RAM, internal hard drive, external storage, graphics adapter, etc.), I would hate for OP to be misled into thinking that a laptop cannot be properly adapted for photo editing. I think that distinction should be clearly made. Those who have advised against laptop use might consider appending a new reply clarifying their remarks. If the bias against laptops for photo work has other reasons besides monitor performance, I think it is important for us to hear those as well. Personally I use a laptop with 23" ISP Asus monitor and full size keyboard attached for photo editing. When I need portatbility for other computing chores, I can quickly disconnect the add-ons and be on my way. I, for one, think a laptop with high quality external monitor and keyboard is the best way to go for the level of photo computing that I engage in. If there are reasons why that combination is not fully useful for some others, it would be valuable for us to hear about it.

rpenmanparker wrote: In repsonse to OP there has been considerable advice against using a laptop for photo editing. If I understand correctly, most or all of the negative opinion regarding using a laptop relates to the monitor stability and calibration response. All that seems perfectly sensible. But if that is so, and there is nothing wrong with the computing power and interface of an appropriately configured laptop (requisite speed, RAM, internal hard drive, external storage, graphics adapter, etc.), I would hate for OP to be misled into thinking that a laptop cannot be properly adapted for photo editing. I think that distinction should be clearly made. Those who have advised against laptop use might consider appending a new reply clarifying their remarks. If the bias against laptops for photo work has other reasons besides monitor performance, I think it is important for us to hear those as well. Personally I use a laptop with 23" ISP Asus monitor and full size keyboard attached for photo editing. When I need portatbility for other computing chores, I can quickly disconnect the add-ons and be on my way. I, for one, think a laptop with high quality external monitor and keyboard is the best way to go for the level of photo computing that I engage in. If there are reasons why that combination is not fully useful for some others, it would be valuable for us to hear about it.
That was my take-away as well. I'm not printing anything over 11x17 at this point so my file sizes are not massive. Right now, my 3 year old laptop is handling the file sizes well. With an extnal monitor and monitor/print profiling I should be good to go for a little while. When my laptop gives up the ghost I'll have to decide whether to stick with a laptop or go to a tower. I'm finding that I take my iPad more often when travelling now rather than my laptop. I save my image editing for when I get home. Thanks for all the great feedback!

Anne G. wrote: That was my take-away as well. I'm not printing anything over 11x17 at this point so my file sizes are not massive.
Bear in mind that if you shoot in Lightroom, it's your camera's RAW files that you'll be saving. The size of your prints is not a factor.
Right now, my 3 year old laptop is handling the file sizes well. With an extnal monitor and monitor/print profiling I should be good to go for a little while. When my laptop gives up the ghost I'll have to decide whether to stick with a laptop or go to a tower. I'm finding that I take my iPad more often when travelling now rather than my laptop. I save my image editing for when I get home.
Agree with previous advice - your laptop + external monitor is a good point to start. Don't forget to make some provision for backups. Easiest method is keep all your images on the laptop's internal drive, and alternate your backups to two external drives.

Model Mike wrote:
Anne G. wrote: That was my take-away as well. I'm not printing anything over 11x17 at this point so my file sizes are not massive.
Bear in mind that if you shoot in Lightroom, it's your camera's RAW files that you'll be saving. The size of your prints is not a factor.
Right now, my 3 year old laptop is handling the file sizes well. With an extnal monitor and monitor/print profiling I should be good to go for a little while. When my laptop gives up the ghost I'll have to decide whether to stick with a laptop or go to a tower. I'm finding that I take my iPad more often when travelling now rather than my laptop. I save my image editing for when I get home.
Agree with previous advice - your laptop + external monitor is a good point to start. Don't forget to make some provision for backups. Easiest method is keep all your images on the laptop's internal drive, and alternate your backups to two external drives.
Thanks Mike! I do shoot raw but I meant that I'm not doing multiple layers in Photoshop, which would make the files much larger. Regarding backups, right now I'm using Genie Timeline to do incremental backups. Then every now and then I'll burn a bunch of DVDs for an extra level of security. I need to get a usb hub because I do have another external drive but have run out of usb ports on the old laptop. I do need to figure out what size monitor my graphics card can handle. Unfortunately, I just have an on-board graphics card, the Mobile Intel 4 Series Express Chipset Family. My laptop monitor is set to 1600 x 900 but I'm not sure how big I can go. I'm guessing 24" would be safe. Also, I just have a VGA connection so that may be a limiting factor. Anyone out there have any suggestions?

PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!

Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to? I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html Thanks!

Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A

Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!

Anne G. wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!
Hi Anne, Maybe I'm confused. Can't you quickly swap profiles by simply going to system preferences and clicking a diferent monitor profile from the dropdown menu? I paid $449 (free shipping) at B&H for my Colormunki Photo. But I'be read several times that they regulalry go on sale for $350. Sorry, I don't know where or when. Sal

Sal Baker wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!
Hi Anne, Maybe I'm confused. Can't you quickly swap profiles by simply going to system preferences and clicking a diferent monitor profile from the dropdown menu? I paid $449 (free shipping) at B&H for my Colormunki Photo. But I'be read several times that they regulalry go on sale for $350. Sorry, I don't know where or when. Sal
Sal- I'm guessing that some of the other NEC models have an easier way to switch profiles. I think I'll live with the control panel version. I wish that B&H had the ColorMunki on sale but it seems to be $449 everywhere I've looked.

Anne G. wrote:
Sal Baker wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!
Hi Anne, Maybe I'm confused. Can't you quickly swap profiles by simply going to system preferences and clicking a diferent monitor profile from the dropdown menu? I paid $449 (free shipping) at B&H for my Colormunki Photo. But I'be read several times that they regulalry go on sale for $350. Sorry, I don't know where or when. Sal
Sal- I'm guessing that some of the other NEC models have an easier way to switch profiles.
I don't know whether it is easier or not, I have never tried to do it via the Color Management dialog in Control Panel. However when I look in there under my monitor, only one profile is listed. If I look under 'all' devices, there are several NEC profiles listed, none of them with meaningful names. I guess could use a profile viewer and see what their internal names are, then add them to the monitor's list. Perhaps ColorMunki Photo lets you give them meaningful names.
I think I'll live with the control panel version. I wish that B&H had the ColorMunki on sale but it seems to be $449 everywhere I've looked.
If you are going to go for a ColorMunki Photo, then the extra $140 you would have to pay for the puck and SpectraView software certainly has to be taken into consideration. If it were just a choice of the ColorMunki Display or the NEC colorimeter and software, then I would definately go with the NEC device. The ColorMunki puck is a spectrophotometer, and so I have heard it theoretically "doesn't do quite as thorough a job measuring dark emissive colors" as the NECs colorimeter puck. But the NEC doesn't do printer profiles at all. Brian A

For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half) and just as good in my opinion. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/798930-REG/X_Rite_EODIS3_i1Display_Pro.html Monitors: You want a wide gamut monitor. Something that gives you around 98% or more of the Adobe 1998 RGB (aRGB) color gamut. Mine gives me 107% aRGB which is solidly in the Pro Photo RGB range. (2 year old NEC Multisync LCD 2690WUXi2) Now let's see what else is out there. http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa241w-bk http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/NEC_PA241W_Review Look carefully at NEC for quality and HP for value. Think wide gamut for photography. The info is out there, you just need to do some serious research.

Steve Bingham wrote: For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half)
Half of what? The ColorMunki Display is around $150 and the NEC device adds about $140 to the price of a monitor. Maybe you are thinking of the ColorMunki Photo, which is about $450, but does printer/paper profiles as well as monitor calibration. Brian A

Hugowolf wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half)
Half of what? The ColorMunki Display is around $150 and the NEC device adds about $140 to the price of a monitor. Maybe you are thinking of the ColorMunki Photo, which is about $450, but does printer/paper profiles as well as monitor calibration. Brian A
Probably. I kept seeing $500 talked about.

Steve Bingham wrote: For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half) and just as good in my opinion. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/798930-REG/X_Rite_EODIS3_i1Display_Pro.html Monitors: You want a wide gamut monitor. Something that gives you around 98% or more of the Adobe 1998 RGB (aRGB) color gamut. Mine gives me 107% aRGB which is solidly in the Pro Photo RGB range. (2 year old NEC Multisync LCD 2690WUXi2) Now let's see what else is out there. http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa241w-bk http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/NEC_PA241W_Review Look carefully at NEC for quality and HP for value. Think wide gamut for photography. The info is out there, you just need to do some serious research.
Thanks Steve! What attracted me to the ColorMunki Photo was that it can also profile printers, which I don't think the i1 can do. As far as monitors, I'm going to have to compromise there because I can't justify spending quite so much on a monitor when I'm not even selling my prints! This is just an expensive hobby to me right now. I'm supposing that any monitor is going to be better than the laptop screen I've been looking at thus far. I am looking at this NEC: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html I know it's not a Pro model but it is IPS. Again, nothing I'm doing is mission critical. I want to be happy with my results without breaking the bank.

Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half) and just as good in my opinion. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/798930-REG/X_Rite_EODIS3_i1Display_Pro.html Monitors: You want a wide gamut monitor. Something that gives you around 98% or more of the Adobe 1998 RGB (aRGB) color gamut. Mine gives me 107% aRGB which is solidly in the Pro Photo RGB range. (2 year old NEC Multisync LCD 2690WUXi2) Now let's see what else is out there. http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa241w-bk http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/NEC_PA241W_Review Look carefully at NEC for quality and HP for value. Think wide gamut for photography. The info is out there, you just need to do some serious research.
Thanks Steve! What attracted me to the ColorMunki Photo was that it can also profile printers, which I don't think the i1 can do. As far as monitors, I'm going to have to compromise there because I can't justify spending quite so much on a monitor when I'm not even selling my prints! This is just an expensive hobby to me right now. I'm supposing that any monitor is going to be better than the laptop screen I've been looking at thus far. I am looking at this NEC:
Boy, you got THAT right!!! I really would go with a better monitor and a used i1. But that's me. Paper and ink can run into serious money - as you flop around. I would use the FREE printer/paper profiles. They work extremely well.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html I know it's not a Pro model but it is IPS. Again, nothing I'm doing is mission critical. I want to be happy with my results without breaking the bank.

Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: For profiling you might want to consider the i1 by X-rite. It is less expensive (by half) and just as good in my opinion. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/798930-REG/X_Rite_EODIS3_i1Display_Pro.html Monitors: You want a wide gamut monitor. Something that gives you around 98% or more of the Adobe 1998 RGB (aRGB) color gamut. Mine gives me 107% aRGB which is solidly in the Pro Photo RGB range. (2 year old NEC Multisync LCD 2690WUXi2) Now let's see what else is out there. http://www.necdisplay.com/p/desktop-monitors/pa241w-bk http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/NEC_PA241W_Review Look carefully at NEC for quality and HP for value. Think wide gamut for photography. The info is out there, you just need to do some serious research.
Thanks Steve! What attracted me to the ColorMunki Photo was that it can also profile printers, which I don't think the i1 can do. As far as monitors, I'm going to have to compromise there because I can't justify spending quite so much on a monitor when I'm not even selling my prints! This is just an expensive hobby to me right now. I'm supposing that any monitor is going to be better than the laptop screen I've been looking at thus far. I am looking at this NEC: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html I know it's not a Pro model but it is IPS. Again, nothing I'm doing is mission critical. I want to be happy with my results without breaking the bank.
cheap. About $50 for 3 days with shipping included. http://www.borrowlenses.com/category/calibrators Lensrental.com also rents them. Just gather all your non-OEM papers that you want to use and generate printer ICC profiles at the same. If you switch over to 3rd part inks someday, then you can rent the CM again, or maybe be in a better position to buy one. Once you use the CM and calibrate a sceen/generate ICC printer profiles, it just sits a long time. I have the Xrite I1D2 with NEC Spectravision II, and use it once a year to check my screen and thecal sure doesn't change much, if any, looking at the data. I also have and I1PRO (aoubt $1K+), never used it on my screen, generated a few ICC printer profiles and it sits as I prefer to use an older Xrite Pulse Color Elite system for printer profiles, and that sits a lot on the shelf also. Bob P.

Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Sal Baker wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!
Hi Anne, Maybe I'm confused. Can't you quickly swap profiles by simply going to system preferences and clicking a diferent monitor profile from the dropdown menu? I paid $449 (free shipping) at B&H for my Colormunki Photo. But I'be read several times that they regulalry go on sale for $350. Sorry, I don't know where or when. Sal
Sal- I'm guessing that some of the other NEC models have an easier way to switch profiles.
I don't know whether it is easier or not, I have never tried to do it via the Color Management dialog in Control Panel. However when I look in there under my monitor, only one profile is listed. If I look under 'all' devices, there are several NEC profiles listed, none of them with meaningful names. I guess could use a profile viewer and see what their internal names are, then add them to the monitor's list. Perhaps ColorMunki Photo lets you give them meaningful names.
Once you create your profile Colormunki let's you save and name the profile anything you want. It then automatically shows up in your display profile list. Just click the desired profile and you're done.
I think I'll live with the control panel version. I wish that B&H had the ColorMunki on sale but it seems to be $449 everywhere I've looked.
If you are going to go for a ColorMunki Photo, then the extra $140 you would have to pay for the puck and SpectraView software certainly has to be taken into consideration. If it were just a choice of the ColorMunki Display or the NEC colorimeter and software, then I would definately go with the NEC device. The ColorMunki puck is a spectrophotometer, and so I have heard it theoretically "doesn't do quite as thorough a job measuring dark emissive colors" as the NECs colorimeter puck. But the NEC doesn't do printer profiles at all. Brian A

Sal Baker wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Sal Baker wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Hugowolf wrote:
Anne G. wrote:
Steve Bingham wrote: PS CS6 needs 500 meg (it will struggle and crash with 250). 1 gb is better. Check your current ionboard graphics. I would bet it is 250meg. Graphic cards are cheap for towers. Laptops CAN be another issue!
Hmm. My laptop graphic card has an Approximate Total Memory of 1759 MB. Is that what you are referring to?
That is probably shared with main memory.
I'm looking at getting this NEC monitor. What do you think? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/750473-REG/NEC_EA232WMI_BK_EA232WMI_BK_23_Eco_Friendly_Widescreen.html
It certainly gets good reviews, although there is no mention of output gamut. One thing always worth considering with NEC monitors is buying with SpectraView and the calibration device. SpectraView allows quickly swapping between different profiles. You mentioned earlier that you only have VGA out at the moment: I don't know how that affects things. Brian A
I am planning to get the ColorMunki so hopefully that will take care of the calibration, although quickly swapping profiles will be a different story. I just have a hard time spending $500 for a monitor plus almost $500 for the ColorMunki plus I'll probably need to get a new computer in the next year or so. Ugh!
Hi Anne, Maybe I'm confused. Can't you quickly swap profiles by simply going to system preferences and clicking a diferent monitor profile from the dropdown menu? I paid $449 (free shipping) at B&H for my Colormunki Photo. But I'be read several times that they regulalry go on sale for $350. Sorry, I don't know where or when. Sal
Sal- I'm guessing that some of the other NEC models have an easier way to switch profiles.
I don't know whether it is easier or not, I have never tried to do it via the Color Management dialog in Control Panel. However when I look in there under my monitor, only one profile is listed. If I look under 'all' devices, there are several NEC profiles listed, none of them with meaningful names. I guess could use a profile viewer and see what their internal names are, then add them to the monitor's list. Perhaps ColorMunki Photo lets you give them meaningful names.
Once you create your profile Colormunki let's you save and name the profile anything you want. It then automatically shows up in your display profile list. Just click the desired profile and you're done.
I think I'll live with the control panel version. I wish that B&H had the ColorMunki on sale but it seems to be $449 everywhere I've looked.
If you are going to go for a ColorMunki Photo, then the extra $140 you would have to pay for the puck and SpectraView software certainly has to be taken into consideration. If it were just a choice of the ColorMunki Display or the NEC colorimeter and software, then I would definately go with the NEC device. The ColorMunki puck is a spectrophotometer, and so I have heard it theoretically "doesn't do quite as thorough a job measuring dark emissive colors" as the NECs colorimeter puck. But the NEC doesn't do printer profiles at all. Brian A
Excellent! Thank you!

Anne G. wrote:
Sal- I'm guessing that some of the other NEC models have an easier way to switch profiles. I think I'll live with the control panel version. I wish that B&H had the ColorMunki on sale but it seems to be $449 everywhere I've looked.
Atlex has a new Colormunki Photo (open box) for sale now for $209. Seems like a great deal. http://www.atlex.com/x-rite-colormunki-photo-1.html

A "high quality external monitor" would work just fine. Ram is important, so I certainly would want at least 8 gb. Post processing has many levels. My computer with 16 gb gets a serious workout almost every week. When you get into a dozen layers on a huge file, memory flies out the window! However, most users can get by with 4 gb. It really depends on what you do. With a 17" print size limit, 4 gb should do just fine.

Steve Bingham wrote: A "high quality external monitor" would work just fine. Ram is important, so I certainly would want at least 8 gb. Post processing has many levels. My computer with 16 gb gets a serious workout almost every week.When you get into a dozen layers on a huge file, memory flies out the window! However, most users can get by with 4 gb. It really depends on what you do.
For what it's worth, I have 5-year old PC running Windows XP with 4GB or RAM. I'm using Lightroom 3 and Photoshop CS5.1 and a fairly basic graphics card. Very usable though (a) I don't use gazillions of layers in CS5 (b) it won't run LR4. The last bit is a gotcha for any XP users intending to use LR for the first time - it ain't possible without upgrading to Windows 7 (or 8).

Add new comment

Image
More information
  • Files must be less than 2 MB.
  • Allowed file types: png gif jpg jpeg.
Attachment
More information
  • Files must be less than 2 MB.
  • Allowed file types: zip rar.